[all_funkt_up]

Originally Posted by Crowie

He is still in jail, in Bulgaria, where the attack took place. Michael Shields is his name and its a very messy case. As for the "real guy" coming forward, well his story had more holes in it than a string vest.

Indeed mate. Michael is due to serve the remaining 8 years (of a 10 year sentence) in Britain though which is a step forward. Graham Sankey (the bloke that admitted the crime) has refused to stand trial in Bulgaria and therefore the Bulgarian courts refuse to pardon Michael. Infact they only last month refused the poor lad a re trial.

Shocking

Anyway, back on to the fans - UEFA's statement is so vague its untrue. They paint a picture of our fans being the scum of the earth but dont actually have any information or statistics to back it up.

Much is made of the fans having a history of bad behaviour and this being a continuation of it. What exactly are these "incidents" that UEFA speaks of? If we are a bunch of trouble makers, why didnt the organising committee introduce measures beforehand to combat it?

I will re-iterate again that UEFA awarded us the title of "supporters of the year" in 2001 - again this contradicts their recent stance that we are and always have been scum.

Should be noted that there was no actual trouble between the rival fans. Its not like we went on the rampage and had running battles with Milan fans. Infact, I cant remember any incident this season involving us and opposition supporters at all.

"We" have a great friendship with PSV fans, Olympiakos fans and Benfica fans too. All borne out of European home and away games and the respect between the 2 groups of fans. There's great banter and respect and even after defeat, the Liverpool fans applauded Milan off the pitch on Athens. Hardly seems like the actions of a bunch of low life toe rags does it?

Contrast that with the behaviour of England fans when they lose, there is simply no comparison.

I see the latest round of exchanges as no more than populist diatribe. Designed to slur the good name of Liverpool fans on the eve of the meeting between UEFA and the British Government. We shall see how much actual 'evidence' is produced as a result of the discussion.

Probably none, but the damage has been done now. The first blow has been struck and no one will remember anything else.

Originally Posted by Raisin Man

Anyon ethink that it might just be that Liverpool have a lot of european football recently so of course a lot of the incidents will involve them.

Agreed and I made that point yesterday.

We have played more European games than most other clubs over the last few years. Therefore the likelihood of incidents increases, the more games you play.

Spurs for example might have played 3 European aways and had 3 reports of trouble.

Liverpool might have played 20 aways and had 20 reports of trouble.

The ratio of trouble makers is the same, only we have played more games.

Stands to reason too that out of 80'000 fans you will get a few thousand scumbags. Fans are a cross section of society and therefore you will get criminals and mongs in every group.