your best laydown ???

[Beanie]

The 22 v ak hand isn't the same situation alex, surely you can see that.

In it you are 50% to win x amount of chips, risking y.

In the 4 way AA, you are 50% to win probably 2 or 3x, again risking only y. You can't try and argue that the spots are of the same value simply because you have the same %age chance of winning.

Overall that kind of poker is going to seriously harm your bottom line in the long run as you are gonna miss out on quite a few 1st places just to avoid a few more bubbles.

[Jezza]

Hi Alex.

I discussed this hand as the opener in this thread. http://www.thedailypunt.com/forum/po...d-reading.html

I will copy paste here now why I folded it and my thought process on the results

"As soon as I got raised on that river I very quickly went to go all in. Then I stopped for a split second and went to call instead. Then I suddenly realised hang on a sec, think about this. (NL tables were extremely new on hills at this time, I think we were on 60second timers ).

I went back and thought through various hands he could have. He raised preflop when he was clearly going to get called by a few limpers, this probably means AQ/AK or a big pair. The flop came down KJ2 rainbow. AK or AA are possibilities for him preflop. However he bets these hands on the flop, almost without question. So I discounted these. On the turn the K pairs and he checks again. I think here he PROBABLY bets QQ (not sure, he might still check to play safe) he still checks TT tho. If he had AQ then if he was going to try and steal it it would have been on the flop (although unlikely as there was 3 of us in), but he probably would have checked. However he could have flopped either a set of kings or jacks on the flop. This is very much the sort of thing he would check as well, hoping someone catches up with him. By now on the turn he would either have jacks full or 4 kings. The four kings is a lot less likely for obvious reasons, but it is a definate, slim, possibility. On the river I fill up and lead at the pot. He raises. If we go back though his hand range, what would he do it with? Yes he would raise with AK but we can discount that as he would have bet the flop with it. He folds TT probably pretty much all the time, perhaps he calls if he is a total idiot. With QQ he certainly does not raise. He probably calls but he does not raise thats for sure. If he was going to steal with AQ it would have been by trying a bet on the flop and not by raising on the river. Therefore the only hands he can possibly have are, the most likely, Jacks full with JJ or the slim chance of four kings. This took me the full 60seconds to comprehend and I really couldnt believe I was about to fold a full house using both my hole cards. It was the first time I had ever made such a fold and let me tell you it was AGONISING at the time. After I "tanked" for the full period I typed what I was folding into the chat box. Such was my agony at making this fold, however correct I had worked it out to be, I knew I was going to have nightmares about it forever more . I folded and he showed. Jacks full. I almost lept out my chair in delight lol. It was a real revelation at the time to me and it opened a whole dimension of poker to me.
"

[alexross]

ah he showed. Beaut. vnh!

fuck hellmuth - i want some of jez's "reading ability"

[Jezza]

i put a full buy in w TPTK v a set last month alex, it aint always that good, we all donk it up sometimes

[alexross]

Originally Posted by Jezza

i put a full buy in w TPTK v a set last month alex, it aint always that good, we all donk it up sometimes

you don't need to tell me m8 - ur talking to king of the donks recently!

[JammySFC]

My best laydown was actually in a home game. I will post it as best i can from memory. It should be ok as it was fairly recent.

I am dealt J J in mid position. It is folded round to me in mid position and i make a standard raise of 4x BB. My friend who is a reasonable if slightly erratic player doubles/trebles this raise and everyone else folds to me. I am putting him on a monster here due to a tell but want to see a flop and can afford to as i am fairly deepstacked.

The flop is dealt and comes 10 8 3 rainbow. I lead out with a fairly substantial bet and he raises me again. I agonise for a while and fold my overpair to an innocuous board. He flips Pocket Aces.

Okay on reflection i probably should laid this down preflop but AK was running through my mind as he is fairly loose so i fancied seeing his flop play before i laid down what i felt may still have been the best hand. I felt this was quite a good play for me, being a beginner.

[Scottieboy08]

Good fold Jammy How's your game coming on m8, played any tourneys recently? Any good results online/live?

[Beanie]

Binned KK v AA preflop a couple of times - their hand was pretty obvious both times as I remember tho.

Mmmm my favourite was at a live tourney. It was the final table and most(not including me) seemed to know each other and there was loads of chatter. I was mega short stacked and only 3 round from the BB which prob accounted for more than 1/3rd of my stack, had a wee look down at AQ - sorted. UTG makes a standard 3x BB raise, no problems there.

Guy to my right folds, and as he does so makes some comment about this guy raising from UTG and cycled through a couple of hands...AA KK AK etc - I can't remember exactly what it was he said but it made me look up before pushing, and something to do with the way UTG was sitting, looking, and the way he reacted to that comment made me push my cards into the muck instead of my chips into the middle.

Right then I knew he had AA, and sure enough when someone else pushed that's what he had.

Just a read/instinct/whatever, it's probably still verging on a bad fold rather than a good one just because of the chip situation, but I liked it nonetheless and in the moment was 100% sure of AA.

Of course I went out next hand

[kompressaur]

I folded and he showed. Jacks full. I almost lept out my chair in delight lol. It was a real revelation at the time to me and it opened a whole dimension of poker to me.

a great read on a great read Jezza. That end bit brought out a giggle and even a wee tear to the eye. Cracking stuff.

I got AA two hands in a row. Is this a record?

[Beanie]

I think so Komp. I thought I had it twice in a row once but it was actually a little crumb of regurgitated Shreddies and I went broke with A4

[MickeyPaul]

[kompressaur]

Aye it was a few months ago now Beanie. I got them and got all excited and scared everyone away. I think i won 200chips with blinds at 20/40 (or whatever they are) i was all disappointed as i needed the win and looked to the ground whilst holding my head in my hands. I look up and what do i see, the exact same hand again. I raise in an early position, 4 folks go all in with me and im doing Klinsman dives across the bed when hit another A on the flop and move right up the standings. Poker is the crack cocaine of excitment and it comes for free in freerolls etc. I love it. I prefer making websites still though

[JammySFC]

Originally Posted by Scottieboy08

Good fold Jammy How's your game coming on m8, played any tourneys recently? Any good results online/live?

I hadn't played online for a few weeks Scottie and was making small profit in home games due to bank account problems. I sorted these a few days ago and turned over small profit the last few days before going profit crazy the last two days and banking over $500. The highlight was 12th out of 1130 in the 25k Guaranteed on FishSquare for $259. I am also slightly pwning $50 SnG's on the same site as they are so soft. So things are going quite well just now, although leaks still exist...